[Ar-list] Continuing dialog

[Carter Butts]

W Isaac Carroll wrote:


> I see several kinds of people who will want to use the Machines MRS:
> 
> 1- Reality designer
> 2- Machine builder (or tweaker)
> 3- Machine user/destroyer
> 
> Each type of user will have different, though overlapping, needs. So the
> question is, which audience are we writing for in this MRS? Perhaps a
> section for each?


Separate sections, I think.  The initial idea was to have a system for 
designing machines which would "compile" a complex "source" design into 
a simple set of attributes and rules for the end user (the "executable 
code", if you will).  This was quite a challenge, and remains so, but 
perhaps you have some ideas on how to proceed.

> Well, I don't (yet) know LaTeX (though it has been a wishful thought of
> mine). However, I am fond of LyX, so maybe I'll get that working. In any
> event, the content is much more important than the presentation, so for
> now I'll just post stuff in text and make it pretty later.


That seems optimal to me.  Or use HTML, which will at least give you 
some basic mark-up capabilities.

> I have run into a problem in my Matrix RG: There is no good reason for the
> Machines to keep humans around in the Matrix. I originally thought that it
> would be enough to say they keep humans around because they need hardware
> to run their AIs on, but I've come to feel that that explanation doesn't
> hold water. So I'm left with an uncomfortable decision: Do I give some
> hokey reason why they keep humans around? Or do I leave it unexplained?
> Neither one sits well with me.


This is Yet Another Problem with that movie...there is no good reason I 
can think of for the machines to keep the humans around, and the reason 
given in the movie (human as energy source) makes no sense at all. 
(Have the superintelligent AIs forgotten about _algae_?)  Some other 
_bad_ reasons you could try include:

1. Some sort of Asimovian "laws of robotics" prevent the AIs from 
eliminating humanity.  (This assumes, inanely, that the AIs are not 
capable of modifying their own programming.)

2. The AIs are divided into internal factions, some of which eventually 
hope to "re-educate" the humans and restore peaceful relations with 
them; the humans lie in a state of stasis while the various factions 
debate their fate.  (This would seem to contradict the movie backstory, 
in addition to being rather at odds with observed AI behavior.)

3. The AIs want to keep humans alive for sheer amusement.  (Not very 
likely.)

4. Some/all of the AIs have some sort of superstitious aversion to 
destroying the human race, fearing that it will bring some kind of doom 
upon them.  (Again, this contradicts the movie, and isn't all that 
sensible in and of itself.)

     Sorry that I can't provide better advice, but as Karim points out, 
this is one of several gaping holes in the movie itself (which was very 
entertaining, but not very carefully conceived).  To what extent is your 
goal to follow the movie directly, as opposed to providing rules which 
support some of the ideas explored within it?  If you seek to try the 
latter, you might also want to explore other cyberpunk visions of 
immersive man/machine interaction, e.g., the "matrix" described by 
Gibson in Neuromancer, etc.  You could then offer the "humans kept alive 
by malevolent machines for fun and torment" as a _potential_ scenario, 
much like the "scenario seeds" SJG typically includes in the GURPS 
supplements.  This might allow you to evade the problem of having to 
create a setting which is both true to the movie _and_ internally 
coherent.  :-)

-Carter